Over at Would You Have Voted for this Society? Mr. Doom wrote a comment, which I have included in full below.
"I agree that in no western country did the people actually vote for the kinds of social changes we've seen in the past half century. And to a large extent these changes were implemented by stealth or in a dishonest and deceptive manner.
On the other hand voters could have taken a stand against such disastrous changes. There have always been alternatives to the major political parties. OK, not always great alternatives, but voters have always had the option of registering a protest by abandoning their traditional allegiances to the parties that have betrayed them. And the voters have steadfastly refused to do so. They have maintained their sheep-like devotion to the major political parties. Even when an alternative was on offer (as was the case with UKIP in the recent British election),
Many people have been excited by the level of support that nationalist parties have attracted in Europe in recent years but what is really surprising to me is just how few people actually vote for these alternatives. In not a single country has such a party even come close to gaining real power.
This suggests either an extraordinary degree of voter apathy, or perhaps outright defeatism. Or even just a total lack of awareness of what is happening."
He raises some very important points and I would like to address them.
Why do people keep voting for the same political parties?
I believe that there are a few reasons why.
Multiple Issues
Real Life Concerns
Economics
Loyalty
No other real option
Lets look at each in turn
Multiple Issues
When voting people are voting for someone to represent them, on various issues. In most cases they have never meet any of the candidates and so they must vote according to the purported believes of a particular party. They rarely, if ever get to vote on single issues. They must try to vote for a candidate who will broadly support their believes. That makes it hard for single issues to get traction, because they must compete with other issues that are just as important. Many people vote not on conviction that this is the best candidate from the best party, but because they fear the consequences of their opponents gaining power.
Real Life Concerns
Many political issues are abstract, real life however has a way of being anything but abstract. People, quite rightly, need to look after themselves in the here and now. Unfortunately that means that voting tends to be about short term concerns. So for example it's not so much about tax policy and how much the Government needs, but instead becomes about tax rates, how much am I paying and can I pay less? Politicians often encourage this, because they are also thinking short term. Real life concerns stop people from thinking about deep issues, as they have more immediate issues to deal with. Will I keep my job? Does that girl love me? Why isn't my child sleeping at night? Whats wrong with my arm, it hurts for no reason? Real life, all of these things are legitimate things to worry about and they get in the way of things that are also real life issues. Big issues that need to be dealt with, Immigration for example.
Economics
The fear of a bad economy is huge, people live in constant fear of the economy. I can never remember a time when the economy wasn't an issue. When people didn't fear it. It stops many people from changing how they vote, because of fear. They need their job and they know that their a plenty of unemployed already. How would they pay for the house, pay their bills, look after themselves and their family? The fear that the economy will go bad is very real, becomes from time to time it does exactly that.
Loyalty
People often vote the way they do because they want to fit in, all my family votes for x, all my friends support x, then so should I. Many people vote a certain way because they have always voted that way. They joined and stayed loyal, even though the party that they are loyal to does not return that loyalty.
No Other Real Option
At the last Australian Federal Election my vote went to Labor, I didn't vote for Labor but thats were my vote ended up. Australia has a preferential voting system, that means that you number all the candidates from your favourite candidate to your least favourite candidate in order. In my electorate, the safest Labor seat in Australia, there were 9 candidates, 4 right of centre, 1 Liberal, 1 Labor, 1 Green,1 Socialist and 1 from the Animal Justice Party and right there is the order in which I voted, Labor in 6th place. So how did my vote end up with them? If your first preference doesn't win, then your vote goes to your second preference and it just keeps doing that until only two candidates are left. Those two candidates then receive all of the votes. In nearly every electorate in Australia the two parties are the Liberals and Labor, in my electorate it's Labor and the Greens.
In a first past the post system unless you vote for the winner you may as well not have bothered to vote.There is no perfect voting system, they all have limitations. But it means that just voting isn't enough. Why were there 4 right of centre parties, each by themselves was nothing special, but together, even in a left wing electorate, they don't win but they get pretty respectable numbers. In more Conservative electorates they would win, if they didn't split their share of the votes. But if they won they would need to have competent policies and candidates. To be honest I feel that these parties are more anti than pro, they know what they are against but they are not so certain of what they are for. And to be frank thats not enough.
The truth is that the options just aren't that good in most cases.
I must disagree with you on one point Mr. Doom, UKIP did splendidly in the last elections, 11 millions votes is fantastic. Only winning 1 seat is unfortunate, but remember that is a 100% improvement on their position in the last Parliament. They are in a great position to do more in the future. My one concern is that they are not a Conservative party any more than the Conservative Party is, but if I was in the UK I would vote for them, I might even have joined. They are a ray of sunshine in a very dark sky.
Upon Hope Blog - A Traditional Conservative Future
Another Article You Might Like?
Multiculturalism and Mass Immigration I
Tuesday, 25 August 2015
Friday, 21 August 2015
Would You Have Voted for this Society?
As I wander through life I wonder how we got to where we are and how do we fix things? I often ask the question "Would you have voted for this Society?" Because the truth is that we never did vote for this Society, Those who are supposed to represent us have instead given us their vision, not ours.
When did we insist on ending Capital Punishment?
We were told that instead of death, Murderers would receive Life, imprisonment that is. Instead the average sentence for murder is 16 years in Victoria, where I live.
When did we insist on Abortion on demand?
Certainly there were people who did insist, but we were never given a say in such a profound issue. An issue of life and death, a moral issue and an issue concerning the future population of the Nation.
When did we insist that marriage for life should end?
We never held demonstrations, or rioted to have divorce in our lives. We never wanted no fault divorce. But we all got to pay for it.
When did we vote for Feminism to be official Government policy?
But it is and it has been for four decades, something we never asked for or wanted was given to us anyway by those who think they are our betters.
When did we get to vote on Immigration?
Immigration has always been a controversial issue and so it remains. Immigration is the transformation of the Nation, the changing of the populations composition. How could it be anything but controversial, but nowhere have we been allowed to vote on this historic decision.
When did we decide to be a Country of multiple cultures?
We never decided, that was decided for us, by those who think they are our betters.
Maybe we would have voted for these things, but we never got that option did we?
Changing our Society, our Country and our Nation is not our decision to made it seems. We live in a Representative Democracy that isn't very representative all. It appears that our job is simply to pay our taxes and be loyal to those who show us no loyalty in return.
How long can Democracy survive when it is a farce?
Would I have voted for this society....NO!!!!
Upon Hope Blog - A Traditional Conservative Future
Another Article You Might Like?
Anarchy and Libertarianism
When did we insist on ending Capital Punishment?
We were told that instead of death, Murderers would receive Life, imprisonment that is. Instead the average sentence for murder is 16 years in Victoria, where I live.
When did we insist on Abortion on demand?
Certainly there were people who did insist, but we were never given a say in such a profound issue. An issue of life and death, a moral issue and an issue concerning the future population of the Nation.
When did we insist that marriage for life should end?
We never held demonstrations, or rioted to have divorce in our lives. We never wanted no fault divorce. But we all got to pay for it.
When did we vote for Feminism to be official Government policy?
But it is and it has been for four decades, something we never asked for or wanted was given to us anyway by those who think they are our betters.
When did we get to vote on Immigration?
Immigration has always been a controversial issue and so it remains. Immigration is the transformation of the Nation, the changing of the populations composition. How could it be anything but controversial, but nowhere have we been allowed to vote on this historic decision.
When did we decide to be a Country of multiple cultures?
We never decided, that was decided for us, by those who think they are our betters.
Maybe we would have voted for these things, but we never got that option did we?
Changing our Society, our Country and our Nation is not our decision to made it seems. We live in a Representative Democracy that isn't very representative all. It appears that our job is simply to pay our taxes and be loyal to those who show us no loyalty in return.
How long can Democracy survive when it is a farce?
Would I have voted for this society....NO!!!!
Upon Hope Blog - A Traditional Conservative Future
Another Article You Might Like?
Anarchy and Libertarianism
Tuesday, 11 August 2015
The Twenty-Ninth Month
A steady month this month, there were some high days and some low days but overall steady. With some great numbers and one I really want to see reversed. And while I haven't posted as much as I would like I am very happy with the quality of what I've been writing.
I also received a very nice comment from Mara in What Do Liberals Want?, it really has made my day reading that!
My best day was the 9th August when I had 262 visitors and my worst day this month was the 29th July when I had 29 visitors. Thats a very low number, but to be expected as I haven't been posting as many articles. I'd like to say that will improve, but we'll see. It's not because I don't have things to say, it''s finding the time to get it done properly thats the issue. But I'll keep pushing through, as we all must.
11th July-11th August
11th June-11th July
Australia, Russia and the United Kingdom as all up in a big way, I like seeing Countries get into the hundreds!
Canada is also up, more modest but still good to see.
The United States is down, by two hundred, I really want to see this number reversed!
Indonesia and the Netherlands are back in the top 10.
Germany, India and France are all down and Greece and the Ukraine have left the top 10.
I have also received visitors from the following countries Ireland, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Finland, Malta, Portugal, Poland, Slovenia, Romania, Lebanon, Israel, U.A.E., China, Hong Kong, Taiwan, Japan, Vietnam, Malaysia, Singapore, Philippines, Egypt, Kenya, South Africa, New Zealand, Brazil, Chile,
I hope to see you again.
Mark Moncrieff
I also received a very nice comment from Mara in What Do Liberals Want?, it really has made my day reading that!
My best day was the 9th August when I had 262 visitors and my worst day this month was the 29th July when I had 29 visitors. Thats a very low number, but to be expected as I haven't been posting as many articles. I'd like to say that will improve, but we'll see. It's not because I don't have things to say, it''s finding the time to get it done properly thats the issue. But I'll keep pushing through, as we all must.
11th July-11th August
11th June-11th July
Australia, Russia and the United Kingdom as all up in a big way, I like seeing Countries get into the hundreds!
Canada is also up, more modest but still good to see.
The United States is down, by two hundred, I really want to see this number reversed!
Indonesia and the Netherlands are back in the top 10.
Germany, India and France are all down and Greece and the Ukraine have left the top 10.
I have also received visitors from the following countries Ireland, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Finland, Malta, Portugal, Poland, Slovenia, Romania, Lebanon, Israel, U.A.E., China, Hong Kong, Taiwan, Japan, Vietnam, Malaysia, Singapore, Philippines, Egypt, Kenya, South Africa, New Zealand, Brazil, Chile,
I hope to see you again.
Mark Moncrieff
Thursday, 6 August 2015
What Do Liberals Want?
At the most recent Melbourne Traditionalists meeting, there was a general discussion about what do Liberals, or the Left in general want? Why is it so hard to argue with them and why when presented with facts are they so ready to ignore them? This is my version of the discussion at that meeting, with particular thanks to Jason and Mark Richardson, but including all those there as it was quite a free wheeling discussion.
It seems to be the week for it as three other sites have very similar posts:
Anotherpoliticallyincorrectblog - Our-self-destructive-elites
victorstamp.wordpress.com - The-change-agents
&
The Orthosphere - Will-we-ever-see-the-end-of-the-liberal-college-professor?
The discussion began with how hard it is to convince any on the Left to see reason, or even to see a fact. How resistant they are to any change in thought and how while they think of themselves as free spirited, they are so alike in thought. So alike it can be terrifying to see and experience and we do experience it. But why are they so resistant? Is it because our arguments aren't good enough, that may be the case, but it would be something someone would get better at if that were true. But experience often leads to despair, not to more "conversions", for want of a better word. There is something else at play, something deeper. To reject any part of Liberalism would lead to a world of confusion and uncertainty. So to avoid that no part that has been picked up can be rejected.
We know this is true from those who have left, they report finding one thing out of place, one thing that didn't make sense and over time coming to reject it entirely. The good Liberal doesn't allow that doubt to remain, they reject it, ignore it and denounce it.
But why? What possible benefit could they received from doing this?
Liberalism and in fact all political philosophies, apart from Conservatism, believe in Utopia, in perfect people living in a perfect world. No war, or anger, no hatred or despair, no hunger or want. A perfect people living in a perfect world. So when you point out a flaw in their plan, a flaw in their vision, they resent it. How dare you try to stop a perfect world from coming into being, how bad and evil does someone have to be to try and deny such a world? Here is not only why they reject facts, but also why they are never fair to Conservatives or Conservatism. They do not see us as people having a different opinion, they see us as evil, because only evil people supporting an evil philosophy would try to stop the making of a perfect world.
They even have a vision of how this perfect world will come about. People need to be united, but are instead divided, by their sex, their age, their ethnicity, their nationality, their race, their religion, their beliefs, there are so many things driving people apart, if only those difference's could be destroyed, done away with. If that could happen, then people wouldn't be divided, then they would be united. So the things that divide people must be done away with and instead people must be made the same, equal, even if they don't want, particularly if they don't want it. Nothing is more important than perfect people living in a perfect world.
People must be made equal, Equality is what will make perfect people. Because unity is perfection, one Human Race without division. A world of equality, in which there is no division is a Level one, where no one is below or above anyone else. So those who are below the line, need assistance, they need to be given preference in jobs and financial support, they need their mistakes to be ignored, they need to be told how wonderful they are simply for existing. If this destroys their families, their communities, if this destroys their well being and their identify, thats a price that Liberals are prepared for other people to pay. Nothing can get in the way of perfect people living in a perfect world, nothing.
For those above the line, they must be leveled as well. This is not about everyone enjoying the good life, thats just a story they tell. What they really want is no rich, no poor, no smart, no dumb, no over achievers and no under achievers. What they want is equality and to achieve that everyone must be Leveled. Those who have done well in life must be brought down, they cannot be allowed to remain unequal.
What do Liberals and in fact all Leftists want? They want perfect people living in a perfect world and they use the ideology of Equality to achieve it.
The truth is that Equality isn't real, it is not possible, nor is it desirable. So that means that perfect people living in a perfect world is also not possible. Every sensible person already knows this. But it is a believe that has captured the hearts and imaginations of far too many people, from the top of society down. It influences every level of Government and society. It is everywhere, this mad idea that we are perfectible, but that does not make it real. We need to fight this madness, because that is what it is.
Upon Hope Blog - A Traditional Conservative Future
Another Article You Might Like?
How Socialism Helped Destroy Marriage
It seems to be the week for it as three other sites have very similar posts:
Anotherpoliticallyincorrectblog - Our-self-destructive-elites
victorstamp.wordpress.com - The-change-agents
&
The Orthosphere - Will-we-ever-see-the-end-of-the-liberal-college-professor?
The discussion began with how hard it is to convince any on the Left to see reason, or even to see a fact. How resistant they are to any change in thought and how while they think of themselves as free spirited, they are so alike in thought. So alike it can be terrifying to see and experience and we do experience it. But why are they so resistant? Is it because our arguments aren't good enough, that may be the case, but it would be something someone would get better at if that were true. But experience often leads to despair, not to more "conversions", for want of a better word. There is something else at play, something deeper. To reject any part of Liberalism would lead to a world of confusion and uncertainty. So to avoid that no part that has been picked up can be rejected.
We know this is true from those who have left, they report finding one thing out of place, one thing that didn't make sense and over time coming to reject it entirely. The good Liberal doesn't allow that doubt to remain, they reject it, ignore it and denounce it.
But why? What possible benefit could they received from doing this?
Liberalism and in fact all political philosophies, apart from Conservatism, believe in Utopia, in perfect people living in a perfect world. No war, or anger, no hatred or despair, no hunger or want. A perfect people living in a perfect world. So when you point out a flaw in their plan, a flaw in their vision, they resent it. How dare you try to stop a perfect world from coming into being, how bad and evil does someone have to be to try and deny such a world? Here is not only why they reject facts, but also why they are never fair to Conservatives or Conservatism. They do not see us as people having a different opinion, they see us as evil, because only evil people supporting an evil philosophy would try to stop the making of a perfect world.
They even have a vision of how this perfect world will come about. People need to be united, but are instead divided, by their sex, their age, their ethnicity, their nationality, their race, their religion, their beliefs, there are so many things driving people apart, if only those difference's could be destroyed, done away with. If that could happen, then people wouldn't be divided, then they would be united. So the things that divide people must be done away with and instead people must be made the same, equal, even if they don't want, particularly if they don't want it. Nothing is more important than perfect people living in a perfect world.
People must be made equal, Equality is what will make perfect people. Because unity is perfection, one Human Race without division. A world of equality, in which there is no division is a Level one, where no one is below or above anyone else. So those who are below the line, need assistance, they need to be given preference in jobs and financial support, they need their mistakes to be ignored, they need to be told how wonderful they are simply for existing. If this destroys their families, their communities, if this destroys their well being and their identify, thats a price that Liberals are prepared for other people to pay. Nothing can get in the way of perfect people living in a perfect world, nothing.
For those above the line, they must be leveled as well. This is not about everyone enjoying the good life, thats just a story they tell. What they really want is no rich, no poor, no smart, no dumb, no over achievers and no under achievers. What they want is equality and to achieve that everyone must be Leveled. Those who have done well in life must be brought down, they cannot be allowed to remain unequal.
What do Liberals and in fact all Leftists want? They want perfect people living in a perfect world and they use the ideology of Equality to achieve it.
The truth is that Equality isn't real, it is not possible, nor is it desirable. So that means that perfect people living in a perfect world is also not possible. Every sensible person already knows this. But it is a believe that has captured the hearts and imaginations of far too many people, from the top of society down. It influences every level of Government and society. It is everywhere, this mad idea that we are perfectible, but that does not make it real. We need to fight this madness, because that is what it is.
Upon Hope Blog - A Traditional Conservative Future
Another Article You Might Like?
How Socialism Helped Destroy Marriage
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